Release a smaller, cheaper Wireless Temperature Sensor for the Smart Radiator Thermostats

jcwacky
jcwacky ✭✭✭

The recently released "Tado Wireless Temperature Sensor" is essential, in many scenarios, to have accurate operation of the Tado Smart Radiator Thermostats. Which, due to their proximity to the radiator, are not typically able to measure the actual room temperature themselves.

However, many find the price (£69.99 / 79,99€) prohibitive, especially when you often need to add one to almost every room. £30 to £40 seems to be an acceptable price point for many. They also find the functionality overkill and don't need touch buttons or temperature display.

Please consider developing a smaller, cheaper Wireless Temperature Sensor, removing the screen and buttons to allow for a smaller case. Making it suitable to sit on a table/shelf as well as able to mounted on the wall would also appease many.

Many calls for this can be found here, in the original request for an external temperature sensor, but which has now been marked as "Released" after the Tado Wireless Temperature Sensor was created: https://tado.vanillacommunities.com/en-gb/discussion/comment/12391/#Comment_12391

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  • Hi @jcwacky,
    Great idea to "UPDATE" this request to concentrate on the price point and functionality requirements. 👍
  • Jacopo2
    Jacopo2 ✭✭✭
    edited February 4
    I know what’s going to happen

    Tado will remove the motor from the Smart Radiator Valve and release that as the cheaper sensor!
  • Or alternatively, creat a API allowing 3rd party temperature sensors. Many smart home users has these installed already.
  • Would be great to equip all my rooms with a separate sensor on the most efficient location!
  • Hi @jcwacky,

    I really like the Tado system, and hope that there will be an ongoing drive for a lot more development and innovation in the future.

    I installed my system only a few months ago and have quickly realised that installing Tado TRV actuators vertically results in totally unsatisfactory temperature feedback and control. It's a shame that installing horizontally is not the recommended advice to all new customers.

    The offset function is nice to have, but a fixed correction cannot correct temperature feedback issues due to radiant heat from a radiator. The latter is not a constant.

    Mounting TRV actuators horizontally or installing separate temperature transmitters are the only viable options in my opinion. The latter is operationally far superior.

    If it is viable for separate wireless temp transmitters to be designed and produced in line with indicated expectations (cost in particular) and the systems can operate successfully with many extra devices then I add my vote to this.

  • Pete
    Pete ✭✭✭
    If a low cost wireless temp sensor takes up one of the 25 limit then many houses will quickly run out of tado capacity.
    I've already got 23 devices so couldn't utilise more than 2 extra sensors.
  • samd
    samd ✭✭✭

    @Pete Have you considered using the 'elbow' adapter which turns a standard upright into horizontal and places the device slightly further from the rad than a 'normal' horizontal would do.

  • Pete
    Pete ✭✭✭

    @samd yes. Thanks.

    I saw that only today. Sounds like a good solution. Wish I'd thought of switching the valve round before, had half my radiators off in the past 12 months (insulating solid walls).

    I'll pick up a couple of those adaptors and give it a go!

    Cheers.

  • Jurian
    Jurian | Admin
    edited April 6

    Even though I can't speculation on potential future hardware I am able to give this information:

    • In 2021, it is highly unlikely that tado will release a cheaper version of the temperature sensor (probably without a user interface).
    • When we introduced the current Smart Temperature Sensor, we looked at what potential customers were looking for in a device that could measure a temperature. Furthermore, we required the UI to be present since the Smart Temperature Sensor is the main sensing device that is included in the Wireless Smart Thermostat - Starterkits.
    • The communities feedback about the current price point has been noted, and we are investigating options for the future.
    • However, the 25 devices limit has played a role in the feature set and price point of the current Wireless Temperature Sensor, when we will look at a cost down version we also have to clearly identify how to communicate this potential 25 device limitation more clearly to prospected customers.
    • Lastly, we have to look if it makes sense to introduce 2 devices that essentially have the same function (one with and one without UI), does that economically make sense for the company.
  • @Jurian,

    Your reply has simply left me speechless, I'm hugely disappointed that you are expressing this as Tado's reason for such a "HIGH" price point for the Temperature Sensor.........absolutely unbelievable.

    If this is the Tado Corporate mentality.....then the company's future is surely in a desperate state.
  • I and many others want to see Tado succeed. They have a lot of significant challenges. The direction their management chooses can make or break them. Good leaders listen first, employ the right people and then set the right directions and goals however tough they may be. Let's hope they do...

  • I would be very surpised if Tado are not currently looking into alternatives to having temperature measurement directly integrated into the SRT as per current design. The associated control issues are well documented and I would go as far as to say that the SRT's are close to unusable when mounted vertically immediately adjacent to a radiator.

  • Completely agree with this, I have 6 smart thermostats and 12 smart rad valves in my system so have spent a small fortune already. Cheaper temp sensors would make the system function correctly. As there’s have said the rad valves don’t allow the room to reach the required temperature. I have set offsets but while that helps with keeping the rad on for longer it doesn’t solve the problem and just causes the rad to come on when it shouldn’t as it thinks the room is colder than it is. Can’t the setback be made to work only when the rad has been calling for heat for a while (not when the rad is cold)? Having rads come on prematurely isn’t exactly an energy saving feature.

  • I'm afraid @dennisoliver is right - if true that does indeed sound like a completely misguided method for determining price points. There are far more sensible ways of dealing with any issues which a small percentage of customers with more than 25 devices might encounter, than artificially inflating prices.

    @Jurian I really appreciate your responses on here, but please communicate to your team that they need to listen to their customer base more carefully and have a rethink of the strategy. Tado will live or die by its community.

  • I also go baffled when I read @Jurian 's response on Tado's reason for the inflated price. Would it not be more sensible to publish a disclaimer that adding many wireless sensors would impact the performance of the entire system?

    We all know the reason why Tado went that route over clearly communicating the technical reasons to users (profits).

  • A disclaimer would be reasonable; better would be to actually work on addressing the limitations. "Decreased battery lifetime" makes no sense to me, as how would adding more devices decrease battery lifetime of existing devices? Similarly "radio range issues becoming more prominent" is surely a function of distance, not the number of devices.

    Of course we cannot blame any company for wanting to maximise profits. You may be right that their current pricing strategy was driven purely by this desire. Without more evidence that is somewhat speculation, but if true it would be very short-sighted and would not bode well for Tado's business intelligence. The best way to scale profits would be to increase their sales volume and customer base, rather than maintaining or even increasing their profit margins. The latter would hurt the former. Given that their technology is already relatively close to excellent or perhaps even best in class, they need to listen to and work with their community of existing customers to eliminate the most significant issues, and then the excellence of the products / service combined with word of mouth and the right type of marketing would ensure healthy growth. I find it amazing how many companies fail to appreciate the value of nurturing this community.

    Anyway, rant over - it sounds like their internal alpha of an SRT with the motor removed may offer a decent solution to this problem. They really should open up the (local) API too like @MikOsle suggested and as mentioned here. Services can benefit hugely from integration with other services, and clearly this can't happen until an API is properly documented and supported. It's absolutely bonkers if this still isn't the case although I see that Home Assistant is able to connect to the cloud API somehow. As a newcomer to Tado it seems crazy to see much of this positive energy within the community being ignored / wasted!

  • GrayDav4276
    GrayDav4276 ✭✭✭
    edited February 16

    +1.......Absolutely agree with my fellow users comments on Tado's recent unbelievable response(s).....😱🙃😤

  • libove
    libove ✭✭

    100% agree that the current €80 "solution" is much too expensive, and comes across as a money grab, not a customer-friendly solution.

    Either another much less expensive wireless device, OR an adaptation to the existing smart TRV to allow a wired temperature sensor to placed at some distance (which ought to be much, MUCH less expensive, AND not require another slot in the wireless network).

  • simonUK
    simonUK
    edited May 10

    please add dynamic offsets, i.e. an offset of X when the radiator/TRV is off, and an offset of Y when the radiator/TRV is on. It's very naughty of Tado to sell TRVs to control room temperatures knowing actually the TRVs are totally inaccurate. Reminders of DieselGate and selling cars rigged to pass tests. I thought German companies were supposed to be the best?


    Perhaps a solution is to open TADO so Zigbee devices etc can send room temp readings? Or Alexa via a routine based on a trigger from a IFTTT device.

  • rafm5
    rafm5 ✭✭✭

    Tado° announced that it has sold over one million smart thermostats in Europe.

    Now, what's the percentage of these users actively involved in the community? I am sure minimal!

    Tado°is not a charity and if there is no return in investment there will be no change. Simply if the cost of releasing something new is too expensive and does not guarantee future income, there will be no change. No competition on the market, no change either. The best (easiest) way to increase profits is not by increase sales volume and customer base, but by increasing margins (no investment needed)

    Don't expect too much from Tado°. You may be speechless or shocked. This is business!

    Apple doesn’t listen their customers either, they develop & introduce new features. End users have no choice, but either accept or not. This is how they go forward. Listening customers is not the best for every business model.