Develop a "basic backup schedule" mode for when Tado outage or loss of internet

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Comments

  • VertigoVertigo ✭✭✭
    edited December 2019

     It would just make it easier to hack the system to run locally and bypass their cloud functionality entirely.

    Using homekit you can do exactly that, it works locally. Using homeassistant via homekit integration probably too, although I havent tested that thoroughly yet, because whenever I move a device from homekit API to tado API or vice versa, I have to contact tado support and beg them to 'activate' my device again, and wait 4 days. I got fed up enough with not owning my tado hardware that Ive ordered some zigbee TRVs and will probably move away from tado if I can find a taker for my hardware.

    They could even be delivered as part of the premium service and drive some extra revenue for them!

    Charging fees for functionality everyone would assume is included, is not a good long term business strategy. My guess is tado is not in the business of making hardware, nor selling software services to end users. They see us as the product, selling our data to energy companies:

    They quite literally sell diagnostics data on our boilers that they are not providing to the owners of these boilers. We dont even get a warning when our boiler fails.

    Anyway, getting OT, but if you wonder what those sofware devs are doing, that may be part of the answer.

  • samdsamd ✭✭✭

    Algorithms are used by tado 360 to analyse things such as error codes, water pressure, and pump speeds. This can enable predictive maintenance to deliver simple actionable resolutions potentially before a bigger problem occurs.

    How can this be done when they have no access to the boiler?

  • opentherm can provide tado with a ton of info:

    https://www.home-assistant.io/integrations/opentherm_gw/

  • samdsamd ✭✭✭

    @Vertigo

    Wow so does that mean that the only connection Tado has to my boiler (NO and COMM wires) gives them the ability to collect boiler data other than when firing etc? If so can you enlighten this thickee!!

  • If you boiler doesnt support opentherm serial data protocol, then obviously, no.

  • samdsamd ✭✭✭

    Worcester Bosch so I'm bullet proof!! Thanks

  • That may support EMS protocol, which tado can also read.

  • samdsamd ✭✭✭

    Sugar! OK I give in!!😉

  • @Vertigo I have no problem with my data being sent to utility companies. I think "heating as a service" is certainly the future. But as you say, this should not come at the expense of personal access to this data.

    Although I agree that charging for expected features is not ideal, it's certainly a lot better than not including those features at all!

    But regardless of what their focus is, improving the user experience of their hardware should still be a priority, otherwise they will lose users and whatever they want to sell, they will not be able to. And some of the changes needed are just so, so simple. It is mind boggling.

  • yes This needs to be revised

  • @Will

     I have no problem with my data being sent to utility companies.

    You should. Its your data. Its up to you to give it to utility companies if you want to. Its not up to tado to collect it, withhold it from you (they are not providing end users with any diagnostic information, or even give them an alert if something fails) and instead give or sell it to third parties.

    I think "heating as a service" is certainly the future. 

    But tado isnt providing us with heating. All they do is collect our data and limit our control over our own hardware.

  • +1 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  • Still no word from Tado on this? @Will I disagree that adding local functionality would make Tado easier to hack - a small schedule table in the hub firmware wouldn't make it easier or harder to reverse engineer but would remove a significant motivation to do so.

    More importantly, lack of a local schedule is probably costing Tado customers when they find out about this. I have recommended people against getting Tado, despite it being otherwise nearly perfect. It's also disappointing that their FAQ implies the system will work with no Internet, when without the Internet the system doesn't work as well as a basic programmable thermostat.
  • I have raised the same issue with no local schedule. TADO should review this issue as internet for everyone does fail every so often so there should be a fail safe approach. I assume the issue is no internal memory on the hub?
  • Another +1 here for Local schedule. I've only had Tado 3 weeks and after reading these forums I'm thinking of getting shot of Tado and changing to Drayton Wiser as they have an option of setting local schedules.

  • fazyfazy
    edited January 31

    Sorry for a "me too" post but I want to put this in my own words and stress just how important it is to design for "offline first".

    My sense of adventure led me to try Tado in the new house - old place had Honeywell EvoHome. The Honeywell was a little boring and clunky in the app, no fancy features but it worked flawlessly with or without the Internet connection. It was literally designed "offline first", i.e. there's a wireless controller with schedules, and if you add the Internet gateway you can use your phone to adjust the schedules. If you lose your Internet connection while at home, you can use the manual controller with touchscreen. If you lose it while away you can't control the heating - obviously - but the schedules carry on as normal. In short, the Honeywell blended into the background and I came to take it for granted.

    Seeing as EvoHome was on the market for 5 years I hoped Tado would have a richer feature set and a nicer app. Worth a try, especially as I could just trial it on one radiator first. Certainly the app is nice, but I cannot fill my house with gear (especially expensive gear) that has such a fundamental design flaw. Instead of buying 15 Tado valves, I might stop at 5. That way, if Honeywell, Tado or anyone releases a system that "just works" in a few years, I haven't wasted too much money.

    In short, Tado has some nice features and it's exciting to get it installed, but after the first few weeks, I want it to blend into the background. Keeping a working heating system is not my chosen hobby. It must work without the Internet like any heating controller, use the Internet to make the experience better and (as that's their revenue model), use the subscriptions to make it even better still.

    (Btw, it's the same with smart light bulbs - I like my few Lifx bulbs for extra accent lighting but won't roll it out throughout the house until manufacturers understand and update the tried and tested design of the light switch instead of abandoning it.)

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