All Tado X devices disconnected
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Hey @colosb I am already using HA for Zigbee and WiFi devices and I was also thinking to get a USB dongle to use as Thread router and possibly have more control over the Tado Thread network. I was curious to see what benefit it has with the Tado system, are you able to see any statistics about the connection between the devices? (e.g. signal strentgh, routing errors, etc.)
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Hi @cardella, I was about to say "no" having failed to find any such information within the Web UI, or any documentation about the REST API commands, but then I managed to find what I think is the applicable REST API command structure definition source yaml file, and from there a command "diagnostics" that I hadn't come across in my previous searching.
It gives me several pages of text about my Thread network, which I haven't looked at much yet, but it does look to include Thread network topology and some metrics with "errors" or "quality" in the name.
(I haven't yet figured out how to map back from Thread node IDs to a specific physical device)[EDIT]: I have spotted that the ID value that appears when hovering over each of my Thread Border Router nodes in the Web UI looks to match the lower 4 digits of one of the 3 "IP6AddressList" entries in my diagnostics output. I haven't managed to match the ID values that appear when hovering over the child nodes. I also don't yet understand why there are multiple values (6 or 7 comma-separated lengthy IPv6 values in my case) in each IP6AddressList entry, and none of them match the IPv6 entries that I see via my Broadband router manager UI or through "arp" linux command. So I still can't yet map back to a specific physical device.
[EDIT]: Looking again, I interpret the diagnostics command data is what is used to create the "topology" view in the Web UI, and the metrics are available under the expanding sections on the right of the screen, though I don't currently know if/how to walk the topology in the Web UI to get data for all nodes & links. The REST API command seems a much easier way to get the full data out and visible together
For example, under "Connectivity" there are metrics with low integer values for "LinkQuality[3,2,1]".
Under "RouteData" there are metrics with low integer values for "LinkQualityOut", "LinkQualityIn", "RouteCost"
Under "MACCounters" (I assume Ethernet rather than Thread related) there are metrics with much larger integer values, such as "IfInErrors", "IfInDiscards" and several more.I didn't see anything about signal strength yet, and I haven't decoded the "LinkQuality[3,2,1]" value meanings.
I will give the links as plain text in an effort to avoid posting link manual inspection delay (I think these are fine, but please make your own decisions):
- OpenThread documentation but couldn't find any REST API command reference: https://openthread.io/guides/border-router
- Potentially useful python library: https://github.com/home-assistant-libs/python-otbr-api/tree/main
- REST API command definitions (yaml file): https://github.com/openthread/ot-br-posix/blob/main/src/rest/openapi.yaml
[EDIT]: this looks to be the documentation for the LinkQuality[3,2,1] fields, but it doesn't explain the meaning of the values:
- https://openthread.io/reference/struct/ot-network-diag-route-data
So to use the "diagnostics" command for example, then having done all the OpenThread Border Router & Thread configuration, including enabling the REST API on port 8081, then you can use via browser:
- http://<insert-your-home-assistant-name-or-IP>:8081/diagnostics
Or on linux command line such as:
curl -X GET "http://<insert-your-home-assistant-name-or-IP>:8081/diagnostics"
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I found a docstring with some more info about the link quality:
There might be more info in there but I have not looked further.
Does Home Assistant gives you any entity from the Thread integration or is it just to manage the mesh network itself?
Assuming you still need to connect the Tado devices through Matter to allow the control from Home Assistant, if I understood correctly with your current setup you are completely independent from the Tado app and you should be able to configure the TRV schedules from HA. With this setup it would be interesting to see if you still have the disconnection problem we are all experiencing here.
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Thanks @cardella. There is a Tado integration for Home Assistant … but it currently isn't working for Tado X. It sounds as though a fix is on the way, and some people are patching it to work in the meantime, but I haven't ventured to do that yet and am inclined to wait. See:
- https://github.com/home-assistant/core/issues/137470
So at the moment I am only using my new Home Assistant Yellow for curiosity inspecting the Thread network.
Currently I interpret that the most meaningful thing I believe I have achieved (via Home Assistant integration with OpenThread Border Router, and Home Assistant mobile app) is to enable multiple Thread Border Routers on my Tado X system - Tado X Wireless Router, Apple HomePod mini, Home Assistant Yellow + OpenThread Border Router. So /if/ the Tado X disconnection issue has anything to do with failure on the Thread network side of the Tado Thread Border Router (WR in my case) /then/ I might have some improved robustness. Or if it still fails, then that could potentially rule out that failure-point.
That said, I have been more fortunate than many here, in that so far I have only had 1 failure, so I am currently/hopefully not the best placed to evaluate the success of any potential fix.
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Seems I have the same issue. Spent all weekend fighting to get a Wireless Receiver, 4 SRVs and a Wireless Temp Sensor installed. The single most frustrating IoT installation I've ever had. Everything failed at the adding to Home step , but ended up in the app saying connected, even though the network symbol was still flashing. Multiple FR's, reboots followed, before stumbling on the requirement buried in a forum post about the requirement for IPV6. So then fought my Unifi GW and Virgin BB trying to get that working and entered back into the loop of trying to add and reset every device. Gradually they connected, no pattern, just seemed random what fixed them. Some would even hang at the mounting stage and wouldn't confirm they had mounted, But finally late last evening everything was online and working.
I do have an AppleTV and an Echo that are apparently TBR's too (according to the thread integration in HomeAssistant) and oddly the Tado and AppleTV were both showing under 'MyHome9' as preferred networks. With the Echo under 'other'. I didn't do anything , that just how they showed up. No idea where MyHome9 came from. (probably all the attempts to get this working, as adding a new device showed as room 29! That's how many attempts I had.
I did open Apple Home after all that, (i don't use it for anything) and spotted the 5 devices in there with the apparent ability to add them. So I did. And they all added first time. huh. Weird, that failed every time when going through the Tado setup. Never mind.
Seemed fine this morning first thing, had a quick check and looked good.
Checked again about an hour ago and EVERYTHING was showing as offline. Started to read another thread where suggestions to reboot the Wireless Receiver were found. Rebooted it and then wondered if somehow adding those devices to Apple Home had messed up the Thread network they were on, so removed them from there as well.
A few minutes later, 1 by 1, they started to come back online.
yay.
20 mins later, all OFFLINE again.
Then without doing anything, started to come back online.
Now all offline again.
And weirdly, HA Thread integration is saying no TBR's found in my preferred network.
Think I've made a mistake ditching Nest.0 -
I seem to be having very similar issues.
My installation consists of:-
Radiator Valves (21):-
5 at software 251.2
8 at software 253.2
6 at software 250.1
2 at software 243.1
Wireless Bridge (1):-
1 at software 245.1
Wireless Room Thermostat (3):-
3 at software 251.3
Wireless receivers (3):-
2 at software 249.1
1 at software 253.1
I have random disconnects, as I write 13 devices are shown as disconnected. Previously the 5G and 2.4G Wi-Fi had the same SSID and I split out the 2.4G into a separate network and added the devices yesterday. It worked great from about 5pm yesterday when I made the change till about 9am this morning, there were a few disconnections, but as it moved into the afternoon there were many more disconnections.
I tried disconnecting (powering down) the bridge for a while but this did not improve things.
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Regarding IPv6, my Broadband provider, Virgin Media Ireland does not support IPv6 routing.
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I think it was confirmed earlier in this thread that the problem that Tado is investigating and hopefully fixing soon is related with the Tado bridges and wireless receiver not coping well with multiple access points in home LAN networks. For example with mesh WiFi systems. I found that disabling the 5G WiFi network and even shutting down some of the access points helped in commissioning the Tado devices through the Tado app.
Regarding the IPv6 notes, here I might be completely wrong of course, my understanding is that the Thread uses IPv6 to address the devices connected to the mesh network, however I don't think that IPV6 is required in our home LAN WiFi/Ethernet network nor it's required on the ISP side. That's why we need bridges to "bridge" the IPv6 Thread network with the LAN network (whatever IP version it uses). Another consideration is that from a device connected to the LAN network you can't ping any of the Tado devices, as a confirmation that the networks are completely separate. Is this completely wrong?
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How is everyone doing with the disconnection issue? Any improvements? Or any new insights?
Prompted by Michael's post above, I see that the Tado X devices firmware has indeed been updated over the last few days (some time between 19-Feb and 24-Feb), including for the troublesome (for at least some of us) Tado X Wireless Receiver. I currently see the following versions:
- Tado X Wireless Temperature Sensor, firmware 251.3
- Tado X Smart Radiator Thermostat, firmware 253.2
- Tado X Wireless Receiver, firmware 253.1
@Michael_Barrett , I was struck by the wide range of firmware versions per device type that you reported above. Any idea why? (e.g. I could imagine for example perhaps different HW versions causing different firmware compatibility/requirements, but Tado X range seems a bit recent to have such a range already? Or some devices not enabled/able to pick up firmware updates? … or … ?)
@Groove200 , you seem to have had quite a battle. Sympathies & best wishes. Did your system come back online, with or without further intervention?
Has anyone here found a way to look-up device name for the Thread Border Routers from the thread diagnostics information (e.g. via OpenThread Border Router, IP6AddressList)?
I can see each TBR has a range of IP6 addresses, starting with fd00 or fdc0 (unique local address, for private networks), to 2001 or 2a00 (global unicast address, for internet access), and fe80 (link-local address, for local communication). I can match the lower digits of the link-local-address to the ID shown in OpenThread Border Router web UI, and I tested by disconnecting one of the TBR devices and seeing which ID was affected. I then deduced which of the other TBRs was which, based on the number of child nodes connecting to each. But it would be nice to be able to determine the TBR devices by some more direct means.
I had tried a few experiments with various commands, such as 'nmap', 'host', 'arp', 'nslookup', 'dig -x'; but couldn't get a device name, and none of the addresses matched what I could see from my broadband/wireless router.
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@colosb Unfortunately I don't know a way of mapping back the node ID's, might be something the ot-cli is able to do, but I've not had time to play around with it.
Also, zero disconnections for me since moving off the Wireless Receiver X thread network and onto the HomeKit thread network.1 -
I have not had anymore disconnection since my last reported one here. Also my kitchen TRV which was always disconnecting and reconnecting on a daily basis, has been stable in the last 5 days.
I also noticed the firmware update, shame we can't see a changelog:
- Wireless Receiver X: 253.1
- Bridges X: 245.1
- Wireless temp sensor: 251.3
- TRVs: a mixture of 253.2 251.2 and 250.1
So maybe Tado released a fix for this 🤞
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I've had no more that I am aware of since the last time. I noticed that in the Nanoleaf app Thread Network section the wireless receiver is reported as an Open Thread external border router. No other Tado devices are reported.
Currently my firmware is as follows:
TRVs 253.2
Thermostats 251.3
Wireless receiver 253.1
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Just had this happen for the first time last night around 03:00 - all devices on the latest firmware.
Woke up to a cold house including my daughter's nursery - what a great product. And such a fantastic response from Tado in this thread……..
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Update from me @colosb / all
After the nightmare weekend and Mondays messing about, I did 2 things.
Factory Reset the Wireless receiver (again) and connected to a brand new 2.4Ghz network that I provisioned on my Unifi GW, that it is the only thing on. A dedicated Tado Wifi if you will.
Gradually, all the SRV's came back online on their own accord. And since then it has been 100% stable.
Now what I have noticed is all the devices have updated to a 253.2 (SRVs) 253.1 (WR) and 251.3 (Temp Sensor).
Before this they were all on 249.x with one SRV seemingly stuck at 216.x.
@cardella the IPV6 bit I mentioned was from this thread - 🤷♂️Install guide for new owners of Tado X eco-system (Unofficial, Version 5) — tado° Community
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Sympathies @jsmith89 . Where did you get to with your system, and which Tado X devices do you have?
Some of us with the Tado X Wireless Receiver found that soft-resetting just that (long-pressing the heating boost button for 9 seconds) brought everything back gradually over the next 10 minutes or so … so at least avoiding the more tedious & time-consuming rigmarole of re-installing all the radiator valves.
Any insights into the symptoms / conditions of your devices & status? … beyond the unwelcome wake-up to a freezing cold house on a week-day morning? Some of us saw the Wireless Receiver online and reporting supposedly normal status, but all of the radiator thermostats and wireless thermostats offline and unable to trigger the heating system.
Do you only have Tado X thread border router (TBR) devices in your system (e.g. Tado X Bridge or Tado X Wireless Receiver or Tado X Heat Pump Optimiser), or do you have non-Tado TBR such as Apple HomePod (mini), Homey Pro, Home Assistant Yellow etc. in your Tado X thread network? The normal starting questions from Support on these issues tends (understandably) to be to check the layout and distances involved in your house/Tado-setup … and if you have good WiFi signal strength to your TBR devices (as above), and then good Thread mesh signal strength to all the Tado X thread devices?
I was daring to hope from a few recent positive comments above that we might have turned a corner in the right direction with latest firmware updates. It would be good to have a feel for whether your issues sound the same as some others here, or if you might have something different?
You might want to consider submitting a support request to Tado too. They will inevitably start with the usual set of questions to understand your setup, distances, and any obvious configuration issues or signal strength challenges, but then you could at least contribute to their knowledge-base, get some feedback, and potentially influence priorities and resolutions.
Congratulations on getting your system up @Groove200, that sounds like progress, albeit rather harder-fought than it should have been. I am intrigued about the firmware updates … or rather the previous lack of updates. Any impressions if that was just due to the system previously not being stable for long enough to successfully do the updates? I assume the battery powered devices should update firmware just fine though non-Tado thread border routers, but I am left wondering …?
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i have the same firmware of @Groove200 and still have frequent disconnection, i also have 3 tado x thread router, 4 thermostat and 12 trvs, big money for an instable system.
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Sympathies @nebbiadigiorno . I hope you get it sorted soon.
When you say "frequent disconnection", is that similar to some of us where the thermostats and TRVs go offline and stay offline, and the Bridge (or Wireless Receiver) remains online and claiming normal status? (I was guessing somewhat that perhaps something was going wrong on the Thread network side of the Tado Bridge or Wireless Receiver, as opposed to the WiFi, Internet, and Tado Cloud side)
What is your current routine to get your system back online? … does it come back by itself (how long)?, or are you soft-resetting Bridge (or Wireless Receiver)? or fully re-installing TRVs & thermostats? or …?
Do you have any non-Tado Thread Border Routers in your TadoX/Thread system e.g. Apple HomePod (mini), Homey Pro, Home Assistant Yellow etc.? (several of us here do; I have the impression they can help in some issues & circumstances, but potentially cause challenges in others …)
I appreciate that it doesn't help you at all, but I have the impression that some of us on this thread are seeing/reporting fewer issues lately, and as above was daring to hope that recent firmware updates might have helped, as well as some users such as Groove200 appearing to figure out their own route to stability. I suppose that, somewhat inevitably, the jury is still out, and we might only later be able to look back and see which issues were related, and what changes fixed what issue …
In case you haven't already found your way there, here are a couple of Tado links where you might find more information:
As something of an aside, I came across this improvement suggestion on my travels, and wonder if the audience of this thread might have an interest in up-voting/supporting it?:
- https://community.tado.com/en-gb/discussion/25678/local-mode-option-for-tado-x
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Just to add another voice to this - tonight my whole TadoX system has gone offline and won't restart. The rest of my thread network is otherwise operating fine. What the hell is going on Tado???
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Oh dear, sympathies @papamaku . Any progress with getting your heating system back on? What have you tried?
What devices do you have in your TadoX system? When you say offline, is that all devices including Wireless Receiver and/or Bridge if you have them showing offline in the mobile app? (if so, that could be a bit different to at least some of us where those remained online in the app and allegedly operating normally though the thread/battery devices couldn't get out through them)
If you do have Wireless Receiver and/or Bridge, then have you tried soft-resetting Wireless Receiver and/or power-cycling Bridge? For some of us that allowed the thermostats to gradually reconnect over the next few minutes.
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H @colosb - I have 2 x bridges, 2 x wired thermostats and 15 x TRVs. Attached is an image showing them all offline.
I have rebooted both of the bridges a couple of times, but nothing changes in the app.
However the downstairs radiators seem to be on at a lower amount, but the upstairs radiators are totally off.
I will be contacting Tado support this morning, but I'm surprised they're not fully engaged in this online discussion, as if this is widespread amongst users, then it's a potential PR disaster and business threatening for them.0 -
Best wishes @papamaku , I hope you get it back online soon.
What do you see in the Tado app under Settings → Rooms & Devices, and in particular if you go into each of your Bridges and look at the status it shows for them? Do they claim to be online and working, or are they offline like your Thermostats and TRVs? How do your device firmware versions compare to the recent summaries from other users recently in this thread?
I don't have any Tado X Bridges in my system yet, so Tado Support or others here are likely to be much better placed than me in what can happen with them and how to get them back. (I won't go back and re-read this thread right now, but I'm sure a few people have described their experiences and actions; but generally it does sound as though contacting Tado Support is a good way forward)
(re-using some words from a different discussion:) Do you have any non-Tado Thread Border Routers in your TadoX/Thread system e.g. Apple HomePod (mini), Homey Pro, Home Assistant Yellow etc.? (several of us here do; I have the impression they can help in some issues & circumstances, but potentially cause challenges in others …)
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I got the disconnection again yesterday night, and I restarted the bridges and receiver multiple times without any benefit this time. I'm contacting the Tado support again as I never got an update from them.
In the last week or two the system was working well and yesterday one TRV got a low battery warning in the app so i charged it and since then the problem started.
By luck the TRV in the living room seems to be able to request heating so at least one room is warm today.0 -
That's a shame @cardella . Best wishes. Sounds like a good call to talk to Tado Support again.
Meanwhile, please excuse me being curious … looking back at your earlier comments, I see that in Feb you also had 1 TRV still online when all others were disconnected. Any idea if it is the same one?
I think you have 1 Wireless Router and 2x Bridges? … is there by any chance a correlation of which Thread Border Router (i.e. WR or Bridges) the working TRV is connected to, or if there is likely a mix of working & non-working TRVs on the same TBR?
Are your firmware versions still the same as your post of 26-Feb? (are TRVs still on different firmware versions, or have they managed to align yet?)
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Unfortunately I really have no idea about all this, sorry for not being of much help (yes I have 1 WR and 2 Bridges). I lost hope about understanding all of this and I'm just waiting for Tado to show us why we paid this not small amount of money for a defective product.
I know well what it means from the developer point of view when customers try to debug issues on their own without having the whole picture. It is easy to get into a rabbit hole when the explanation might be much simpler. However if I was not being transparent or not communicating well with my customers in the way that Tado is doing with us, I'd probably be hearing from my managers pretty soon. In our case it seems we are powerless unfortunately.
At the moment of writing the devices are back online but one, but I don't remember if it's the same that was offline also the other times. I feel it might not be but I can't be sure.
The firmware versions seems to have changed. Now I have all TRVs at 253.1 but one which is still 250.1. This is my kitchen TRV which is the farthest from the bridges but the closests to the Wireless Receiver, however it is the one that used to periodically disconnect and reconnect. between the TRV and the wireless receiver there is a kitchen island and a doorway, not even a wall to explain the lack of connectivity.
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Found this thread from Googling.
All my Tado X devices (9 of them) simultaneously disconnected last night just as we were going to bed. Only installed them a few weeks ago. Woke up in the middle of the night and happened to spot they were all offline. Held the hot water button down on the Wireless Receiver for 9 seconds to restart it, and everything came back online slowly. Lucky I did, or my baby and toddler would have woken up to an extremely cold house.
Smart Radiator Thermostats x5 - firmware 253.2
Smart Radiator Thermostats x3 - firmware 253.3
Wireless Temperature Sensor x1 - firmware 251.3
Wireless Receiver - firmware 253.1
Bit dissapointed in their support. Suggested I check my internet connection. Even if my internet was patchy when the device went offline (it wasn't, the internet was working just fine), it shouldn't require the whole system being reset to come online again.
If Tado are not able to solve this quickly, I would love to see the soft restart (holding the button for 9 seconds) on the app as abutton, so I can trigger this remotely if I ever need to.
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Welcome to the club. Unfortunately there is no workaround and the only thing that seems to help is to move the bridges you have around to see if you find the best spot for them. The Tado support will just ask you pointless questions but I guess it's good to keep bothering them, the only thing we can do0
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Since my post on the 27th feb my system has been rock solid.
Until today.
Woke up to everything except the wireless Receiver offline.
Gah, here we go again0 -
Hello,
My installation is composed of 2 bridges, 1 wired thermostat and 10 TRV.
Yesterday (at 21:25) I had sudently 4 TRV and the wired thermostat offline. All at the same time, while the bridges were both online.
During the night, at 2:20 the offline devices went online again and … 3 other TRV went offline… all at the exact same time. They are still offline today !
What the hell is happening ?
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One more thing. The devices that went offline during the night were in my room. I was actually woke up because they made a long noise like opening / closing. Were they reset during the night and caused the issue ?
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