[Released] Launch an external temperature sensor for the Smart Radiator Thermostats

Steve78

As others have said - I have suffered this issue since investing heavily in Tado. The TRV temperature reading is all over the place. Had to get Tado to switch off their ability to call for heat and just operate them as a simple on / off (25 / 15 degrees) in the schedule - with the main downstairs room thermostat controlling when the boiler is on.

I was so pleased when i got an email just now from tado about this sensor with a 15% discount code. Then I saw the price - £70!!! That is ridiculous. I would need 3 or 4 of these as a minimum to sort out my system and ideally more. Why couldn't they just release a £20 sensor. It doesn't need a display, it doesn't need a humidity sensor.

I won't be buying any unless the price decreases to below £40.

Steve

tadcad01

Agreed, its daylight robbery. These thermostats are not worth more than £40. Get a grip Tado and keep your customers happy, your reputation is at stake here!

PiTRiS

Whow, I was waiting for this for some time, as my thermostat is right next to a fridge, which can get warm and confuse a sensor... but that price? What a ripoff... Even though I received 15% discount, which takes it down to around €67, it's still terrible price for such basic device, considering the price of full thermostat...

Btw, for anyone interested, on amazon.de it's available for €60 right now as daily deal. Not much of a difference, but better than nothing...

Malaroo978

Amazon have deals on at the moment. £49.99 for the wireless temperature sensor and £129.99 for 4 radiator thermostats. I just purchased the 4 radiator thermostats (£32.50 each) to use as temperature sensors.

Still not making any sense to me - I would prefer the sensor unit (even though it is too big for what's required) but when I need about 8-10 of them the price difference adds up.

Don't get me wrong - the price is better when on deal like this but I think £49.99 should have been the launch price and circa £30 the deal price. In line with the radiator thermostats (maybe start doing volume packs like the thermostats?)

Unfortunately as pointed out these are a necessity if using the smart TRVs as the temperature is so far off. Only difficult with the valve as a thermostat is finding a good place to put it.

jelockwood

@Malaroo978

Thanks for the heads up that Amazon have a special offer again on this. (Currently no other resellers do although if AO stock it they will price match.)

I have bought two, I already have enough TRVs and don't want to use them as temp sensors. I also have a spare Smart Thermostat bought secondhand which can be setup for this function. I might get a couple more of these temp sensors next year if Tado or someone else has not got a better solution by then and assuming a similar Amazon offer occurs.

It should be noted that their are table stands on eBay for mounting both the Temp Sensor and Thermostat since both are the same shape/size.

Tado should be careful as other brands are gradually catching up. Netatmo have just updated their Thermostat to add hot water and OpenTherm support and it already had HomeKit support. (It does not support eBus.) Hive have HomeKit on some of their products but not all, in particular Hive hot water control is not available via HomeKit. Both offer smart TRVs.

samd

@jelockwood I am not aware how accurate TRVs or tado wall thermostats should be but I need to state that in addition to tado TRVs inaccuracy, their Smart Thermostats (not the latest ones) are not completely accurate. Measured against a recently calibrated (iced water) meter - 0.9°c out.

jelockwood

@samd If they are consistently a fixed amount out then the standard offset function will help and should be more successful than the TRVs.

Koli

I ordered one from Amazon for £49.90 today. I currently use TRVs as temperature sensors and it works perfectly fine with one exception - master bedroom. TRV is placed on a bedside table and it quite noisy. The one on the radiator is acceptable. I agree that £69.90 is a robbery, however the wireless sensor is a very new product and as always early adopters are willing to pay over the top. Tado is understandably making the the most of it. I also like to support them to ensure they can keep going, I invested hundreds into my Tado gear and I do think they are a good company that deserves to survive. At least until Google buys them out and runs them into the ground (mark my words!).

I won't buy another sensor though, even if it comes down to £30. I already have TRVs for sensors so they would become redundant and sit in my cupboard. Now I will have one spare TRV, it's nice to have a backup but one spare is enoug.

Chimmy

It's already possible to correct the temperature from cheap external sensors. (I use SmartThings.) We just need a (seemingly) small change to the firmware to make it viable. For anyone who wasn't already aware, you can upvote that request here.

PiTRiS

Whow, it just arrived... and... well, I'm not sure what I was expecting but... why is there hole to connect themostat cables on the back? :D They simply just took the original thermostat and ripped out parts to connect it to thermostat and probably removed few things from firmware. Otherwise, they didn't bother with anything else... I was not gonna mount it on the wall, but keep it standing on the table, but with those holes... ugh... Guys, look at netatmo, how they thermostat can look when used in wireless mode.

I'll see if it helps with temperature meassurements in the room I need it in, otherwise it's a quick return... Or I'll buy some cheap full thermostat second hand...

Jacopo2

I wasn’t expecting them to spend hundreds of thousands of Euros for new injection moulds
Are the cable terminals still there?

PiTRiS

Yes, pins still there... Guess if you were to connect these and flash thermostat firmware, you'd have full thermostat :) As they were too lazy not to make new backcovers, the board will be the same as well...

Here some pictures of the back of the "new" "sensor" https://photos.app.goo.gl/NGnMyARFdT85NRAM8

HGB

Is it safe to show serial number and auth code?

PiTRiS

Damn, missed that :) updated...

PiTRiS

Hmm, i just realized, that you cannot have it standing anywhere :)) as it is same as thermostat, one of the 2 holes which I suppose are for the air to get in and out to temperature sensor would be covered if it were standing... well, this is fail on so many levels :(

jcwacky

@PiTRiS Not sure it's worth the price, but have you seen this?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Stand-for-Tado-Smart-Thermostat-Tado-Thermostat-Desk-Stand-with-Mounting-Screws/274277365732

PiTRiS

@jcwacky I have not, but that actually looks good... and definitely not worth the price but i know a guy who knows a guy who has 3D printer :D

Anyways, if I keep it, what I'll do is probably tape it under the living room table... I don't really need to see it or control anything with it. Also it's unnecesarilly big... damn, if they just made some $10 temperature sensor, like you can buy from xiaomi/etc... or have some good integration for something like that...

MarkW

@PiTRiS From my experience the sensor ideally needs to be located approx 1.5m from the floor. Lower than this and it is just not effective and you may as well just rely on the smart TRV to control the heat. From experience, with the sensor ‘mounted’ (I used the 3m removable picture/hook fixings to try different locations) on the wall approx 1.5m ffl, the heating works efficiently. Lower than this and heat will be called for a much longer period with no additional benefit. I assume this is due to the heated air from the radiator rising and filling the space in the room from the ceiling down to the floor hence the lower the sensor the longer the heating will be on.

I had initially repositioned the TRV’s horizontally to move them further away from the radiator and found this to give better & smoother control with less need to use the ‘offset’ function. I have also noticed that the TRV’s appear to work more accurately (whether horizontally or vertically installed) in rooms with hard flooring? I have added a number of remote sensors this year in rooms where previously this meant applying the offset to obtain some form of control and combined with the repositioning of the TRV’s so far have not used the offset in any rooms. Hopefully this will mean that come next spring the heating will not be coming on because it believes it is 5deg colder than it actually is and I won’t have to constantly be adjusting the offset as it gets warmer.

Putting aside my feelings about Tado (poor support, poor battery life although this may improve now, cost, flawed TRV sensing) I do feel it is probably the best (I have tried others) system available at the moment, particularly the geofencing operation. I now really feel I may have turned a corner and actually have a setup that seems to be working as I had always expected it to. Time will tell, both in if it continues to work as it is at the moment as it gets colder through the winter and whether the ‘new’ set up has any effect on my gas bill.

NellyFurtado

Just to let everyone know, they temp sensors are back down to £46 at Amazon.

GoodBranch

Hi. I bought some on " offer " at Amazon and Costco. I thought that they would improve my system and increase controllability but they have been a nightmare with support being confusing and sporadic. I have requested a lot of support and complained. I was sure that the Bridge connection was dropping causing the TRV's to demand heat. I was losing sleep as the ' dumb ' thermostat rads all came on often in the middle of the night. I started to put the system and Away mode but even then they came on and at 1am I even cut the power to my boiler!

Clearly issues and despite being advised to move the Bridge every which way but which it still occurred. Eventually customer support advised me just to return the 11 TRV's as I was such a nuisance to them that was the best solution in addition they would withdraw my customer support.

On other topics in this Community chat frequent mention is of the poor connectivity. I requested a booster or connect to my MESH / Wifi network not possible and it was clearly made out that it was my set up! No mention was made of a load of folk demanding a Bridge booster. It was basically just me! I should buy them for all my rads!! Yet, the system only really allows 10 with full controllability. The system is not designed for larger homes. Older brick / stone walls.

I do like Tado and have had it since circa 2013 but this episode has not been pleasant. Heating coming on when it should not. Customer service delays. Confusing advise. Poor connectivity, etc. etc.

Joead

@GoodBranch I'm afraid I'm experiencing the exact same functionality issues as you since installing 3 temp sensors. Lots of Bridge connection drop outs causing tvrs calling for heat when they should be off as per their schedule. So you are defo not an isolated case.

GoodBranch

Thanks for that Joed! I was beginning to doubt my sanity whilst padding around my house at 1-4am in search of the " rogue" TRV/SRT!

Words of warning.

They will NOT work as planned.

If you require customer support. Just look out the window and floating by shall be a lesser spotted blue piglet!

Prepare for sleepless nights just like having a newborn!

Be prepared to be knocked back! Problems with Tado / connectivity / TRV/SRT they are THE best around!! Yea right!

Get ready to ask your Bridge to do the Hokey Pokey to improve connectivity.

Then, when all else fails and Support are fed up they suggest you send it all back if you are not happy ( and they have lost the little patience that they have/had!)

Good luck but persevere!

Dunkelmann

I have just added a temperature sensor. I have started getting connectivity dropouts. Coincidence or is a pattern developing?

tnemrap

They should also allow to set actual temperature thru API for us that already keep track of the temperature in every room.

HGB

There should be an option to have a web based surroundings in which a 'master' user has more rights than other users to read data end change settings.

RichF

I have managed to get the smart TRVs to work correctly by fitting an Oventrop adapter between the radiator and Tado valve. I have created a new post with more details in to make it easier for people to find, see here:

Solution for smart thermostat radiator valve (TRV) inaccurate temperature measurement.

RichF

21 Dec 2020

Hi, I like many other people have struggled with the completely inaccurate temperature measurement of the smart TRVs, this causes the radiators to shut off before the room has warmed up, the Tado solution to use the offset feature doesn’t work for me, or I suspect anyone.

I have managed to get my smart TRVs to work as they should by using an Oventrop 1011450 adapter that rotates the smart TRVs by 90degs so they are horizontal, this adapter can be fitted to the existing valve without the need to do any plumbing like drain down the system. Rooms I have added the Oventrop adapter to now work perfectly, just as well as using a separate temperature sensor. I have attached a picture of the Oventrop adapter and one of my radiators with the adapter fitted.

https://us.v-cdn.net/6031070/uploads/AGNATVAKBP1V/oventrop.jpg

https://us.v-cdn.net/6031070/uploads/EF2BJXU5UCEF/pxl-20201221-112123806.jpg

The Oventrop adapters cost around £8-9 each (including delivery) if you order 4. The Oventrop adapters don’t appear to be available from UK plumbing merchants (none I tried anyway), but you can get them from ebay and amazon retailers who all appear to be in Germany. Therefore the delivery charges can be quite high, hence it’s best to order several at once to keep the cost down. I used an ebay seller called “ml-haustechnik” (I have no connection with them) who was the cheapest at the time and delivery about 4 days from Germany to UK (eBay item number: 331468588631), but there are other sellers you can choose from. Prices on amazon are higher, although many of the retailers seem the same.

The Oventrop 1011450 has a M30 x 1.5mm fitting at both ends, this is the same as the Tado TRVs so you won’t need to use any of the Tado adapters if the Tado TRVs fit on to your radiators. If you currently use an adapter, then you will still need to use the same adapter to fit the Oventrop adapter to the radiator, the Tado TRV will fit directly on to the Oventrop adapter. Oventrop do make another version of this adapter with different fitting, I think it is part number is 1011460, so just be careful you are ordering the right one.

I have not been able to find anyone else who makes anything similar in the M30 x 1.5mm fitting (Dandoss make some similar for their TRV connection type), so if anyone can find a cheaper alternative, please post-it.

I have vertical Tado TRVs fitted to all my radiators including the ones I have fitted the Oventrop adaptors to. The vertical TRVs work normally when positioned horizontally, the only difference is the display is read from the radiator end in the vertical TRVs which is slightly less convenient in the horizontal configuration.

I think the Oventrop adapters work because the Tado TRV temperature sensor is both further away from the radiator, and is facing away from it. Therefore, the “radiated” heat from the radiator doesn’t cause the Tado TRV to heat up and trick the sensor into thinking the room is hotter than it is. The Tado TRV can now measure the room air temperature through “conduction” heat transfer which is what it should be doing.

It is disappointing that Tado still haven’t recognised this problem or created a solution that actually works, but if you still want to persist with the Tado offering, then this approach worked for me and is cheaper than purchasing separate Tado sensors for each room.

---

View Post

Simon_M

Thanks RichF, looks like a simple solution, I will certainly give it a try.

Drei

I think the beter solution for this problem wil be to release a new radiator thermostats with just an actuator and receiver inside in combination with external temperature sensor.

IvyHouse

+1!

We suffer exactly the problems described in this post. Any response from TADO?

jcwacky

@IvyHouse Tado's response has been to release the "tado° Wireless Temperature Sensor": https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B08D6VJVFG/ However many people are not happy with the price (£70).