Launch a range extender or upgrade to mesh network

135

Comments

  • @Haldon If the investigation results into an answer that we can't increase stability with a single bridge per account, the next obvious thing to look at would be to see if we can allow multiple bridges somehow.

  • @Jurian Why is bridge stability only being looked into now? You’ve literally known about this issue being a problem for years.

    It’s been reported multiple times on this support site dating way back.

    I’m sorry but this is extremely enlightening on how Tado has been run to date.

    That along with the admission that a range extender is not even being considered let alone already in development is all I need to know at this point: after this heating season ends it’s all going on eBay and I’m switching to Drayton Wiser which does offer a range extender.
  • Pete
    Pete ✭✭

    @jurian,

    investigating whether device signal can work better with the existing hardware is admirable but inevitably is a fob off (we all know that).

    As @Haldon points out, we’ll happily pay for a repeater.

    @alvoryx clearly knows his stuff, perhaps you can give him the source code so he can make the “slight firmware modification”. Or open source some code to let the community do it.

    Alternatively maybe a passive or active UHF booster could help (like used for digital TV boosters)?

    For me, basic reliability trumps all other improvement requests. I suspect 50% plus of users have suffered signal loss at one point or another.

    Surely bullet proof signal would be a great selling point for Tado as a whole. People with money to spend on smart heating frequently live in large houses, catering only for medium/small domestic properties is always going to be a business limiting strategy.

    You really must reconsider the decision to not immediately start work on a repeater bridge. I’d happily be a guinea pig for a basic prototype.

    Thanks.

  • @Jurian

    I'll be honest, I've spent in the order of £800 deploying these valves, room thermometers and both AC and heating controls on a new house we bought last year. If you said here's a range extender for £30-£50 I'd buy two in a heartbeat. It's what I had to do for Ring devices. If you have a large house you kinda accept the dis-economies of scale.

    So, saying you're going to look at a free software fix is cool, but I'd rather fix the problem with additional bridges/repeaters/range extenders and be done with it. Others mileage may vary, but If you are to continue with the V3's then I think you should give people the option of buying the extra device.

    Let me know before 28th Feb, as otherwise this lots going back to Amazon (where I have posted 4 reviews already)!

    S

  • @stevearmstrong I am fairly certain that there won't be a fix before the end of this month, hence I would urge you to return the devices as soon as possible so we can part as friends.


    A more realistic timeframe is months, not weeks.

    I will try to keep everyone posted in this forum on any updates.

  • stevearmstrong
    edited February 15

    I don't need a fix, I used to own a software company so I know how long dev takes.

    All I'm looking for is a commitment from management to look at "fixing it with hardware" rather than software.

    And thank you for finally venturing into the community forum and at least answering our questions - it is appreciated.

    Steve

  • Dragunov
    Dragunov ✭✭✭

    Well my attic still needs a heater, but aslong as I cannot put an extender on the second floor or the attic, then Tado is a no go...

  • alvoryx
    alvoryx
    edited February 16
    Of course people would buy a repeater if it would exist <_<

    What do you guys believe ?

    It is obvious that if you a ready to spend 1000+ euros on a system like this one, you are not looking after 50euros to make it work...

    It's not like adding a thermostat to a room which benefit is more or less arguable, we are speaking about a device without which the whole system is totally useless.

    I mean common I feel like we are talking about elementary things here. Makes me afraid about how this company is hold. Is your goal to sell your products only to people owning small flats with 4 vans or rather to big houses needing 20 vans ?

    ?!?!?!?!? Tado is clearly shooting a bullet in his own feet with this "strategy".

    Then there is the lack of control which is 'extreme' and inacceptable at the current stage. For example, if you don't want people to know about things like firmware updates (for whatever dark reason) OK, but at least let people choose WHEN they install. For example, not in the middle of the night where this results into waking everyone one up by collateral effects....
  • Schippie
    Schippie ✭✭✭

    Hi guys. I had lots of connectivity issues with my tado valves losing access as well, on a daily basis in fact. Almost 2 weeks ago, I got a replacement internet bridge sent to me by tado. And behold: no problems at all anymore after replacing my bridge with the new one!

    I don't know about your personal situations of course, but apparently my bridge (bought end of december 2020) was not 100% ok. The new bridge, clearly, has way better coverage. I even moved two tado radiators to what I expected to be the most difficult locations (bathroom, with concrete floor & home office on my 2nd floor pretty far from the bridge). They have been running without issue for 2 days now, as well.

    Again, not saying that it will fix your issues too, but for me replacing the bridge totally helped. Against my expectations, actually. But still.

    So perhaps those of you with range issues & fairly recent purchases also can be helped out with a new bridge? I would suggest contacting customer service anyways.

  • +1000 for a range extender or anything that works.

    Thinking about this... suppose a have 2 bridges installed and hook them up to Home Assistant. I wonder if that could work...
  • @FredSki That’s a great comment. I’ve connected my Tado to Home Assistant and it works well. In theory two would work together too. It would mean that the Tado app would be redundant as that cannot connect to two bridges at the same time - but Tado themselves have said that they are unfortunately not working on this. But Home Assistant is brilliant! When I say Goodnight to Alexa in the lounge the lights are dimmed (and turn off in two minutes), the TV turns off and now the heating turns off on the lounge only too.
  • Pete
    Pete ✭✭
    @Ben84
    Sounds good. Is Homeassistant technically challenging to set up?
    Also, if you have taso two bridges I guess there might be an issue with calling the boiler. Maybe 1 bridge would just open and close valves rather than switch the boiler on?
    I also read elsewhere on this forum (but not sure I believe it) that multiple tado bridges cant operate from the same public IP. That would be a very unusual resitriction imo.
  • @Pete
    I started with Home Assistant just over 2 years ago. I’m not in IT and it did take a little reading up on the internet to get started (I’ve put it on a Raspberry Pi). However over those last 2 years the Home Assistant software has massively improved and adding new ‘integrations’ eg. Tado is now very easy. Within HA I use Node Red to control my automations (as it’s easy to see how the logic links together). That takes a little perseverance to get started, but it’s extremely powerful once understood.

    I must admit I only have one Tado system so cannot comment on having two bridges on the same IP, but in theory I reckon some HA/Node Red logic could be set up to heat another room (to call the boiler), when the second set of valves need hot water.
  • I'm a very recent new Tado user and am pleased with the product. I previously had a disastrous experience with one of Tado's rivals (TRVs not fit for purpose, perhaps you can guess which ones) but I totally agree with the sentiments in this thread; a range extender should be part of the Tado product range. 

    I've only had a difficulty with one TRV losing connection (twice after a few days of faultless operation) but this is putting me off buying further Tado TRVs, which I would very much like to do, because our house is largish.

    So yes, I'd like to add my voice to the requests for a range extender, please.

    Hugh

  • I would like to add my support for this topic too. Similarly to the folks here who’ve spent a small fortune on TRVs for every radiator in the house, I have one in my office which is constantly loosing signal due the the walls being foiled backed. The simple solution would be to plug another bridge into the switch I have in this room.

    Tado - please sort your act out here...
  • Pete
    Pete ✭✭
    @Vinney
    That's a great point. Foil backed insulation could cause signal issues even in a small house.
    Hopefully tado will confirm soon they are working on a bridge repeater.
  • CliffD
    CliffD
    edited March 1

    Had Tado a few years now - still can't believe this limiting factor.

    I'm sitting in a cold room - as the TRV has lost connectivity again...

    TADO - a range extender or multiple bridge please!

    I see TADO posting questionaires asking me about new products etc - PLEASE LISTEN - this is the biggest issue TADO faces as a product....

  • Fully agree that a way to extend the range is needed, either through stuff like a 2nd bridge being possible or a dedicated signal extender / repeater / booster
    I simply cannot understand why this isn't already a feature in a supposed smart home gadget in year 2021

    Being meet by offline smart devices is beyond stupid, and since I have to have child lock enabled, I can't event manually change the temperature when devices goes offline
  • sign me up for a range extender.

    I guess I have been quite fortunate so far. Out of the 22 knobs, I only have issues with 1 that works for 30% of the time and loses connection the remaining 70%. In that same room I have a tado wireless temp sensor, but unfortunately the knobs are not smart enough to make a direct link with the wireless temp sensor instead...

  • I'd happily buy a range extender or support having a system with multiple bridges. Seems like an obvious solution to a frequent problem.

    For others with flakey connections (ie everyone...) has anyone had issues specifically with the wireless receiver attached to a combi boiler? I've just posted about my setup and the problems we've got with it here and I'd be grateful of any useful input.

  • beeftrader
    beeftrader ✭✭
    edited March 11

    I've solved my range issues eventually (12 TRVs + room thermostat, 200sqm apartment). YMMV, but it was a combination of:

    • Positioning the Bridge higher up, facing down. Tado's official suggestion is point it up, since they probably assume you have your electrical sockets lower than where the TRV is installed (our TRVs are installed on the top pipes, not vertically on the bottom like in the UK). The Bridge is slightly above the height of my radiators now. This might help in apartments with wooden floors where signal is lost under the floorboards. I'm not sure the best approach for multi-storey dwellings. I originally had it taped a little to the wall, and tried various angles, but free-standing and hanging down worked best.
    • Forcing firmware upgrades to all be on the same version. This was a slow process, moving stubborn devices closest to the Bridge, taking batteries out for at least 15 minutes, and only bringing each device back online one at a time, waiting until I saw it re-calibrate and update correctly. I think my Bridge was just struggling pushing the firmware update to a device that it had a weak connection to.
    • Switching around "problematic" devices closer to the Bridge. This one made the least sense, given all devices came from Quattro Packs with batteries at the same level, and devices further away but next to each other were more reliable than devices closer to the Bridge.
    • Using a PowerLine adapter and giving at least 5m distance from my WLAN router.

    I've had almost 20 days now with not a single minute of connection-loss. That's after 6 weeks of constant and daily problems.

  • beeftrader
    beeftrader ✭✭
    edited March 12

    Well, I spoke (wrote) too soon. After rebooting my wireless router, I now have constant issues with 3 TRVs in the same direction away from the Bridge, constantly dropping in and out of connection, even when there's nobody at home and no wireless devices moving around the home.

    If a wireless router can knock TRVs offline this easily, I guess there's no chance that tado will ever improve unless there's the option for a signal booster/repeater/external antenna. I'd upvote this suggestion 1000 times if I could.

    Edit: Ah, and there goes another TRV offline in the complete opposite direction. And as I type this, one of the previous one jumps back online (but for how long). I wish tado realised that these problems are difficult to diagnose and resolve within 14 days of purchase (for online returns). The money-back guarantee doesn't work when you're writing back and forth for 2 months with support and getting nowhere (and having to do most of the diagnosing and testing yourself). tado has to be the most frustrating purchase I've had in decades...

  • Pete
    Pete ✭✭

    Hey @beeftrader

    That's interesting. I suspect the problem is unrelated to your wifi. Wifi operates at 2.4Ghz and 5Ghz and the the Tado devices operate at 868 MHz using 6LoWPAN. Other items that operate at around 900Mhz could possibly impact it. Conventional wireless stats (from neighbours perhaps), garage door openers, some cordless phones etc.

    I've got my bridge in the loft, mounted below a large tin foil flat reflector. This fixed most of my issues. I've also positioned a small curved tin foil reflector behind the radiator TRV as a temporary measure until I do something better.

  • @Pete Hi Pete - aware of that, but I'm struggling to find any other explanation for it. Connection was markedly worse when I had a UniFI AP mesh setup when I first installed tado, but I've switched to a UniFi WiFi 6 router which meant I could remove all my mesh nodes entirely. That helped quite a bit with stability. Interference from neighbours I've generally ruled out as I know the layouts of their apartments (floorplans from a purchase/sale in the building), and I don't have any neighbours below. Even though they're on different frequencies, there is no doubt some form of interference related to a device on my network that connects to the router, or the router itself.

    I guess tado knows that the much more powerful antennas in wireless routers cause havoc with the tiny little antenna they've got in the Bridge, as they mention to place the Bridge away from the router at https://support.tado.com/en/articles/3479030-i-have-tado-heating-products-installed-and-my-app-shows-that-there-is-no-remote-access-how-can-i-fix-this.

    I wonder how many of our problems could have been solved with an optional LoRa antenna connector personally. I couldn't give a damn about the optics of it - the Bridge itself has the brightest lights of any device in my entire house, and it has to be placed like a sensitive little child in the middle of the house. At this point I might as well build it a shrine and decorate my house around it.

  • @Jurian

    Although I agree with most of the people that something needs to be done about the poor signal quality and frequent dropout of devices. I don't necessarily agree with the most suggested solution of a repeater!

    My complaint is more related to the fact that when I bought my Tado set (about 9 months ago) it was advertised to use mesh techniques (similar to what we see in Z-wave, Zigbee and other home automation protocols). After having some connection issues and having a chat with the support desk (about 6-7 months ago) it was clear this was unfortunately not the case.

    I personally guess this problem could be solved for most if not all users, because the distance between individual (TRV-)devices will, in most of the time, be relatively close. Unfortunately the system currently depends on a point to point connection between the bridge and the device, which becomes very hard to find due to the network, power and enough coverage requirements to be capable of reaching all devices.

    I think if a chip is already used that supports mesh techniques (which I guess is the case, based on the specifications) this could benefit most, if not all, users!

    I know the use of meshing techniques with battery powered devices is undesired because of the additional battery usage, but if setup intelligently (which I think is possible since you don't have to consider other vendors) I think it is possible with relative low additional battery usage. Most users will likely accept this little additional "battery cost", because currently (from what I have read) they sometimes drain the battery within weeks?! when not being connected, because of the reconnect actions!

    I know from experience it can be difficult to setup these mesh networks (I work as a programmer for a company that develops drones for businesses and we use these kind of wireless chips our self's as well), so I don't expect it to be solved tomorrow, but can you investigate whether your development team is looking into these techniques and possibilities (if not can you hint them towards it 😉)?

    If you and/or your development team like, send me a PM I could possibly help out or point in the right direction if you'd like.

    Kind regards,

    Spikey

  • Yes - I'm yet another customer who can't get adequate range despite locating the bridge in the middle of my home. This property is a flat on two levels, not a palazzo. Come on Tado - you need to sort this out as you are losing customers. My mesh network works everywhere in my home at a minimum of 50 Meg at the furthest corners!

  • I have similar issues, I have moved the bridge around, placed it high, low and upside down, I feel like I have tried everything, and one or more thermostats are often offline (which one differed depending on the location of the bridge). Additionally I sometimes loose connection to everything, which an automated restart of the bridge fixes for me. I would love both an extender and some better bridges. I believe the solution is hardware as no other technology that I have can reach the entire house without meshing or multiple access points.

  • I had all of the above issues until i received a new bridge from Tado. Not a single drop or disconnect or out of range error since then!

  • Pete
    Pete ✭✭
    Hi @Haldon
    Sounds good.
    How long ago did you get your new bridge?
    Is it a different version to your old bridge?
    How far away from the bridge is your furthest radiator valve?
    Cheers.
  • I received it roughly 5 days ago, installed it right away. It's on the same spot as my old bridge, same cables even. The furthest valve is 3 floors up, thick concrete.


    It came with an older firmware version but it updated itself to the latest, same as my old bridge: Firmware: 60.8

Sign In or Register to comment.

Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!